Most of the applied work in the SSP group is done in the "traditional" way, by studying a domain of application; using a formal language to describe aspects of the domain; then providing automated support for some form of problem solving using the formal representation. This is what happens when, for example, we take a business process modelling language like BSDM; give a formal interpretation of its main notations; then provide automated support tools for BSDM modellers. In this sort of application our sense of "engineering" is determined by the methods and lifecycles which have evolved in domains. However, there are also styles of engineering which are inspired by formal languages in an abstract sense - techniques editing being the most obvious example for SSP people. If it were possible to invent modelling lifecycles which are composed from these abstract forms of structuring but which also have application in domains then we might be able to obtain a more transparent, general relationship between logics and modelling. We shall discuss this possibility, using an example.